The Overseas Property Investment Forum

Dotty · #**171** 09-05-2008, 03:25 PM

You need to get planning permission to build ,whether it be infront of the beach or in a city.You will need to get intouch with the authorities in Forteleza with regards to their rules and regulations on building in the state of your choice.Because very often people buy land ,begin to build without authorization to then be lumbered with an embargoed sign ,so always check before you decide what avenue to take.

Quote:

Originally Posted by FCZ

Hi There!
I consulted 6 developments around Fortaleza, to my surprise 4 are completely sold out, and the only two that still have units left are supposed to be ready by mid 2011! The construction company seems to be very good and I liked the apart. designs (3 bedroom, around 100m2, 175,000 Dollars). I will not reserve without seeing the place (1 in Cumbuco, 1 in Porto das Dunas). To tell the true, it doesn’t seems to be a great value, at the end, the land under my feet belongs as well to whomever lives above or below me. But I will check when there a couple of months from now. If we like it… I’m curious if anyone knows the minimum distance allowed for a construction. The ad says 50 mts from the beach, and it really looks like just few steps when I checked the pictures.
Actually, I don’t personally like beach front, just a walking distance is ok. My sister has a house in the South, things get rusted (car, fridge,…) after a while. One of the developments I saw has lifts for just a couple of floors; just to add maintenance costs…
My plan B (or C) would be to buy a couple of land plots, so I can build a house in one (just nice, not fancy would be ok) and use the second land plot for my hobby, gardening/landscape, best of the worlds, beach and gardening (the other one my wife doesn't allows...

) . I saw a couple that were either very far from the Fortaleza/Natal or didn’t have on site security & maintenance. And condominium with a dozen houses just mean high monthly fees for something that will stay closed 10 months a year. It will take longer than I was expecting to find just the right thing.
Back to the question, anyone knows the allowed distance from the beach… Thanks in advance.
P.S.: I haven't checked RN yet, but I will later on.

Camelungi · #**172** 13-05-2008, 04:03 PM

from what I remember when I looked into this land should only be built on 30 metres from the high watermark. And that also goes for rivers and lakes. But this doesn't stop people from trying to building near the water. Aparently people who build by the beach have to pay some kind of tax to the Brazilian marines/Navy who own the land along beaches...I have heard people say that is the case.

For any new build under the 30 metre limit - there is a risk if the civil engineers from the planning offices see this I am sure there could be problems.

It is worthwhile finding out just what Brazilian building laws and regulations are like before purchasing.

Regards

Quote:

Originally Posted by FCZ

Hi There!
I consulted 6 developments around Fortaleza, to my surprise 4 are completely sold out, and the only two that still have units left are supposed to be ready by mid 2011! The construction company seems to be very good and I liked the apart. designs (3 bedroom, around 100m2, 175,000 Dollars). I will not reserve without seeing the place (1 in Cumbuco, 1 in Porto das Dunas). To tell the true, it doesn’t seems to be a great value, at the end, the land under my feet belongs as well to whomever lives above or below me. But I will check when there a couple of months from now. If we like it… I’m curious if anyone knows the minimum distance allowed for a construction. The ad says 50 mts from the beach, and it really looks like just few steps when I checked the pictures.
Actually, I don’t personally like beach front, just a walking distance is ok. My sister has a house in the South, things get rusted (car, fridge,…) after a while. One of the developments I saw has lifts for just a couple of floors; just to add maintenance costs…
My plan B (or C) would be to buy a couple of land plots, so I can build a house in one (just nice, not fancy would be ok) and use the second land plot for my hobby, gardening/landscape, best of the worlds, beach and gardening (the other one my wife doesn't allows...

) . I saw a couple that were either very far from the Fortaleza/Natal or didn’t have on site security & maintenance. And condominium with a dozen houses just mean high monthly fees for something that will stay closed 10 months a year. It will take longer than I was expecting to find just the right thing.
Back to the question, anyone knows the allowed distance from the beach… Thanks in advance.
P.S.: I haven't checked RN yet, but I will later on.

10km · #**173** 10-06-2008, 02:18 PM

Could anyone let me know the following .

1) How much approx does it cost to set up a company

2) Would I have to be present in Natal to sign the documents

3) Does a 99% rule exist .ie a Brazilain has to have 1% of the company

4) If an acountant was employed what likely charges would be incurred

5) If the buisiness account was inactive would an accountant still be expected to be paid a monthly retainer .

6) What reporting is required once a buisines account has been set up . ie monthly . quarterly e.t.c. .

Any help anyone can provide would be appreciated .

Mike

timatthebeach · #**174** 10-06-2008, 02:56 PM

cant help much 10KM but know a little so here goes
1)if the company is so you can get residency you will need quite a bit of cash. it used to be £50,000 but i think i is now £25,000 investment into the company - this money can then be used to buy a property or start a business etc.... plus any set up costs eg lawyers, accountants and noaries fees. obviously these set up costs vary wildly from region to region and firm to firm.

2) you would have to be present in Natal with a passport and CPF no.

3)you may own 100% of the company HOWEVER you will need a person with Brazilian residency to be the administrator until you gain residencia. This is a BIG issue as you will have to know and trust this person implicitly as until you can become administrator they will have access to the company accounts and be able to do anything on behalf of the company. I believ some big law/accountantcy firms offer to be administrator for you until residecnia comes through but this is obviously expensive.

4) you will need an accountant to set up the company and again charges vary from firm to frim. I know someone who was charged 1250 reis (approx. £380) but this was in the southern interior - no idea of charges in Natal.

5) no idea

6)not sure but with a small business doing not much business i would imagine accounts being done on a yearly basis would be ok. but you would have to check that.

I believe there are people on this site (rob and mike) who have set up companies in natal and would be able to help alot more. good luck

Dotty · #**175** 10-06-2008, 03:46 PM

Most importantly it depends on what type of business as different rules apply depending on what type of business you want to open!Will you want to work alone,company simples partnership etc,etc ?

Accountants are salaried on a monthly basis.
All salaries need to be registered and all inss paid for staff otherwise you will probably end up in court!
The best thing to do is check with a lawyer who understands brasilian law.There is one in the lawyer thread with her email and she speaks english fluently as she lived in the States for a number of yrs and is now in Natal.Her name is Carol.

timatthebeach · #**176** 10-06-2008, 04:00 PM

only type of company i know anything for sure about is limited (limitada) which would be most common type in any country. the answers i gave are very rough and asking someone on here who has done it is one step. but ultimately you will need to speak to an accountant or lawyer (but lawyers always charge more

) in Brazil.
I cant remember the name but there was a company mentioned in another thread which is a brazilian law firm with offices in london and is a good firm (according to posts on here - so maybe by people working for the said company, who knows)

timatthebeach · #**177** 10-06-2008, 04:02 PM

oh by the way i asked my friend and he said accountants are normally retained on a monthly basis but as everything its negotiable. as theyre retained you wont need to count them as staff and pay relevant version of national insurance. it would be like getting an invoice for a service rendered to your company.

robh · #**178** 10-06-2008, 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by timatthebeach

only type of company i know anything for sure about is limited (limitada) which would be most common type in any country. the answers i gave are very rough and asking someone on here who has done it is one step. but ultimately you will need to speak to an accountant or lawyer (but lawyers always charge more

) in Brazil.
I cant remember the name but there was a company mentioned in another thread which is a brazilian law firm with offices in london and is a good firm (according to posts on here - so maybe by people working for the said company, who knows)

Tim,

What you wrote in your previous post is mostly correct (it is R$3k and up for the company, and you don't need to go to Brazil to sign). Anyone from outside of Brazil can only open a Ltda., so this is really the only choice and as you say it is wisest to talk to a lawyer.

Regarding the lawyer you are talking about in London, I contacted them ages ago about opening a company for me and the woman I talked to seemed more interested in pitching me to send our clients to them than opening my company. I didn't even receive a quote for the services that I required so I went elsewhere.

Dotty's lawyer friend might be good, but there is no way on earth I would deal with a lawyer who uses a hotmail email address, that doesn't seem very professional to me.

10km PM me if you want the name of the lawyer I used.

PAUL-brasil · #**179** 10-06-2008, 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 10km

Could anyone let me know the following .

1) How much approx does it cost to set up a company

2) Would I have to be present in Natal to sign the documents

3) Does a 99% rule exist .ie a Brazilain has to have 1% of the company

4) If an acountant was employed what likely charges would be incurred

5) If the buisiness account was inactive would an accountant still be expected to be paid a monthly retainer .

6) What reporting is required once a buisines account has been set up . ie monthly . quarterly e.t.c. .

Any help anyone can provide would be appreciated .

Mike

Hi Mike,

1) About R$1,000 from an accountant, Lawyers will charge about R$3,000 some Lawyers will charge about R$5,000. (note this is just for the opening of a business from what you asked, not applying for your investment visa if you invested $50K usd)

2) No, If you can scan and send copies of your passport, CPF, proof of adress in your home country and Birth certifiate.

3) For a limited company they needs to be 2 partners, can be of any percentage i.e 99.5% - 0.5%. The other partner does NOT need to be a Brazilian which many people seem to think (including some Lawyers in brazil). What you do need though is an business administrator who is Brazilian or a foreigner holding a RNE (a permanant resident), to administrate the company until when/if you the owner receives a permanate visa (then have the RNE) to take over the administration. You need to TRUST this administrator! Although a lawyer can put certain restrictions on a contract for the administor so if the administrator did steal money from the business account atleast the law would be on your side, (would still be a huge hassel to say the least)

4) Normal is the minimum monthly wage (present R$410), can often negociate lower though!

5) Yes, the accountants job would still be needed by law to simply fill in a form to the tax office stating inactive!!

6) a few different tax reports to be made, some monthly some quartly, half year, and annual.

Welcome to business in Brazil, its so much fun!!!
Hope that helps you.
Regards
Paul

Dotty · #**180** 10-06-2008, 04:44 PM

Rob ,

You are an agent and should not judge people because they have an email.You have one also.I have her work numbers too and I would not have mentioned her had I not thought she was unable to deal in property issues.You should contact her as she has experience with the leading law firms in Natal and specialises in Property Law,Purgery and Marital Law.

Quote:

Originally Posted by robh

Tim,

What you wrote in your previous post is mostly correct (it is R$3k and up for the company, and you don't need to go to Brazil to sign). Anyone from outside of Brazil can only open a Ltda., so this is really the only choice and as you say it is wisest to talk to a lawyer.

Regarding the lawyer you are talking about in London, I contacted them ages ago about opening a company for me and the woman I talked to seemed more interested in pitching me to send our clients to them than opening my company. I didn't even receive a quote for the services that I required so I went elsewhere.

Dotty's lawyer friend might be good, but there is no way on earth I would deal with a lawyer who uses a hotmail email address, that doesn't seem very professional to me.

10km PM me if you want the name of the lawyer I used.

Property in Brazil - General buying and selling tips for Brazil - Page 18

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